Wake-Up Wal-Mart Blog: Another Walmart Shoplifter is Killed

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Another Walmart Shoplifter is Killed

This article was originally published by the Huffington Post.

You steal, you die.

That's the international policy apparently at Wal-Mart stores, where reports indicate another alleged shoplifter has died at the hands of a gang of overzealous Wal-Mart workers -- this time in China.

According to the Associated Press report this week, Yu Xiachun, a 37-year-old woman, died 500 yards from the Wal-Mart store in Jiangxi province. Based on the local police report, Yu had exited the store and was on her way home on August 30th when she was surrounded by five Wal-Mart workers, who accused her of shoplifting.

The Wal-Mart workers asked Yu to produce a receipt, which she did. But then Yu tried to take the receipt back -- questioning who the four men and one woman were, because no one was wearing a Wal-Mart uniform. The police say that the Wal-Mart workers fought with Yu, and she was knocked to the ground. She was taken to the hospital, where she died three days later. The police have arrested two of the young Wal-Mart workers who fought with Yu. It is not clear yet what they are being charged with, if anything.

Wal-Mart's domestic 'loss prevention' strategy seems to be one of 'shoot first, ask questions later.' This horrible outcome in China is reminiscent of the equally appalling story from August of 2005, when 30-year-old Stacy Driver, a master carpenter and the father of a two-year-old son, died from a heart attack while lying face down in a Wal-Mart parking lot in Houston, Texas. Driver was pinned down on the burning hot pavement by several Wal-Mart workers who accused him of shoplifting a package of diapers, a pair of sunglasses, a BB gun, and a package of BBs. "When we got there," a paramedic said of the scene, "the man was facedown (in cardiac arrest) with handcuffs behind his back. About 30 people were saying, 'Let him up, it's too hot,' Another employee brought a rug for Driver to lie on, but one of those holding Driver said he was fine where he was. One eyewitness reported, "After about five minutes, (Driver) said, 'I'm dying, I can't breathe, call an ambulance.'" After Driver was handcuffed, the eyewitness said one employee had his knee on the man's neck and others were putting pressure on his back. "Finally the guy stopped moving" and the employees got off him. They wouldn't call an ambulance. "I looked at him and said, 'Hey, he's not breathing,' but one guy told me (Driver) was just on drugs. I told them his fingernails were all gray, and finally they called an ambulance."

Three years later, in December of 2008, another Wal-Mart patron died in North Myrtle Beach, South Carolina. Patrick Donovan, 53, died over $393 in Wal-Mart merchandise, lying face down in the giant retailer's parking lot. Donovan's death came at the hands of three Wal-Mart workers, who wrestled the alleged shoplifter to the ground, where the man died. The Wal-Mart workers and one bystander held Donovan down, while one leaned on his back and another held down his arms and head. The police report says Wal-Mart workers told Donovan to stop fighting, and asked witnesses to call 911. By the time Donovan had stopped struggling, he had died.

Wal-Mart has been very quiet in response to this death in China. All the company has told the media is that "an incident occurred" between two of its "security associates" and a "female visitor." In past incidents, Wal-Mart's corporate office has refused to discuss its procedures for detaining and using force against shoplifting suspects. But here is their policy: Wal-Mart has an entire Loss Prevention Associate Guide. In that guide, it says that employees should "address the shoplifter politely and directly." It says that "reasonable force can be employed if the shoplifter refuses to return (to the store)." The policy goes on to clearly state, "If the situation becomes violent, or is deemed potentially dangerous, you should allow the shoplifter to leave." Wal-Mart Guides don't seem to carry much weight at the local store level.

After the Houston incident in 2005, a spokesman from the National Retail Federation said, "Most retailers have a policy of not going into a chase or getting into a combative fight with someone. Most retailers' policies would say that if a person becomes combative, let them go. You can tell police, and let the police handle the investigation and follow up."

It is only a matter of time before another 'visitor' to Wal-Mart is killed for allegedly shoplifting. In a matter of minutes, Wal-Mart will try, convict, and sentence the visitor to death in their parking lot. This corporation, which boasts that it has squeezed all the inefficiencies out of the supply chain, also has managed to squeeze out its customers' rights to protection under the law, and due process. Wal-Mart's loss prevention team needs to set a higher priority on preventing the loss of life at their stores.

You steal from Wal-Mart, you die.

Posted by Al Norman - September 8, 2009 04:52 PM - Hard to Believe

Comments

As usual, WUWM is leaving out information that is contrary to the point they are trying to make. That makes this blog reek of union propaganda.

For example.. the article describes Stacy Driver as an upstanding guy ...carpenter and father... who was brutalized and abused by ruthless Walmart employees for no apparent reason. The article mentions that employees were unsympathetic to Driver by saying "He's just on drugs." What the article conveniently omits is that Driver WAS on drugs and was running from WM employees because he WAS stealing. I'm not mentioning that because I think it excuses the employees behavior. It's important to mention because the coroner determined that Driver died because he was on meth.. not because it was hot or because he was handcuffed. The Walmart employees WERE wrong.. they didn't go by the book in their pursuit... but to be fair, that's not what killed Driver.

"You steal from Wal-Mart, you die"? Not quite... because many, many, many people steal from Walmart with minimal or no punishment. The article SHOULD have closed with "You do meth, you die."

Posted by Ike - September 12, 2009 06:43 PM

Ike,

WalMart employees are not police. No amount of drugs in your system will change that simple fact.

Besides, do you even understand the difference between actual cause and proximate cause?

Posted by ThaMothership - September 13, 2009 07:34 PM

ThaMothership,

No, they're not police. As I wrote, it doesn't excuse the employees' behavior.... they clearly did not follow procedure.

I certainly understand the difference between proximate cause and actual cause. Meth was the actual cause of death. Follow your logic a little further to determine the proximate cause. Driver may not have died if he wasn't being detained by those employees. Then again, maybe he would have died anyway... he was on meth, afterall. But, he wouldn't have been detained if he wasn't stealing. His heart wouldn't have been stressed if he hadn't sprinted and resisted detention. Actual cause carries more weight because proximate cause requires a certain amount of speculation.

So, why did WUWM publish an article that mentioned a half-baked proximate cause without mentioning the actual cause? If you're going to accuse someone of causing someone's death, it seems as if the actual cause of death should be mentioned somewhere in the accusation!

Also, as a side note: WUWM has criticized Walmart in situations where they had police on site to handle crime. In that blog and others, WUWM claims that Walmart should have MORE employee security to deter crime. But, OTOH, WUWM implies that Walmart's security employees are undertrained murderous thugs.

Posted by Ike - September 14, 2009 01:29 AM

They wouldn't have detained him if he wasn't stealing... You must be joking. That's a common joke amongst prosecutors when they know they have no case. "What do you mean there's no evidence? The cops wouldn't have arrested him if he wasn't breaking the law!" If cops can't get away with it, what hope do WalMart employees have?

Now, as for proximate cause... Let's say I think someone stole my wallet, so I pull a gun on him. Let's assume he has a heart condition, but is lazy about taking his meds. The gun scares him; he has a heart attack and dies. The actual cause of death is him being lazy and not taking his meds. The proximate cause is me sticking the gun in his face.

Do I go to jail? Does it matter if he really was stealing my wallet or not? Does it matter whether a heart attack is a reasonably foreseeable outcome of sticking a gun in someone's face?

Your words: "Actual cause carries more weight." That's like saying hearsay is inadmissable.

Here's another term you probably don't know: Respondeat superior. Look it up.

Posted by ThaMothership - September 14, 2009 02:01 AM

Fantastic! Another "legal expert"! Hearsay IS inadmissable. Hence the "hearsay objection."

I understand you're getting worked up here. But let's stay focused. The point I'm trying to make is that, if the UFCW wanted credibility, this article should have mentioned that Driver was on meth. To that you say....?

Also, I never excused the behavior of the employees. I only assert that Driver's behavior contributed to his own death. I'm objecting to the way the UFCW attempts to portray him as a model citizen to suit their agenda.

Posted by Ike - September 14, 2009 07:52 AM

ThaMotherShip-

Also- In your hypothetical example, the person died from a heart attack... not murder or even attempted murder. If you are trying to argue that the robber is innocent while the person who pulled the gun to protect himself is the criminal, then we have a serious difference of opinion.

You ask if it matters whether or not the guy was stealing your wallet. Yes, it does... because if he wasn't, then you shouldn't have pulled a gun on him.

Now, I ask... does it matter if it was a gun that you pulled? According to your logic, you would be a murderer if you had pulled out a BB gun... or threw a snap bang to scare him off... or startled him by screaming for help ...or stressing his heart by running and making him chase you... or stressing him out by telling him you were calling the police... or intentionally saying "Boo!" loudly. Your scenario is ridiculous and you know it.

Either way... that is not the point of this debate. We're not arguing about actual vs proximate cause, we're not arguing about respondeat superior. We're not even arguing about whether or not Walmart killed Driver. We're arguing about whether or not the UFCW intentionally leaves out pertinent information in their blogs and what that does to their credibility.

Posted by Ike - September 14, 2009 10:39 AM

Ike,

Thank you for proving my point. As any second year law student knows, hearsay is defined by its exceptions. That is why you spend 10 minutes learning that hearsay is inadmissible, and then three weeks (and a lifetime of practice) learning all the myriad ways it is admissible.

So, the statement "hearsay is inadmissible" is an overly-simplistic, and sophomoric assertion by someone who thinks wikipedia and Law and Order reruns are an adequate substitute for an education at an accredited law school. The same goes for your statement that "actual cause carries more weight."

If I seem worked up, it's only because I'm laughing so hard.

You repeatedly decry what you feel are missing facts, but you don't seem to realize that there are two necessary parts: Facts AND law. This is why you did not understand the hypothetical scenario. For example, as a matter of law, the hypothetical suggested the tort of wrongful death, and perhaps the crime of assault. NOTHING in the hypothetical suggests either murder or attempted murder.

Would it matter if the person used a BB gun? Maybe; maybe not. The court would ask: Was it reasonably foreseeable that someone could mistake a realistic-looking BB gun for a real gun? Especially if it is quickly shoved in their face in a menacing manner?

The answer is yes. It is a subjective test, where all that matters is the victim's reasonable belief that harm is imminent. It doesn't matter if you intended to shoot him or not, if the gun was loaded or not, or even if the gun was a fake. What matters is whether the victim reasonably believed you were going to shoot him. Just because you are incapable of killing him (for any reason) doesn't mean you're off the hook if he believed you were capable and intent on doing so.

So, could someone be liable for a death caused by pulling a BB gun? Yes.

Could someone be liable for throwing a snap-bang? This is very unlikely, but as a matter of law, it is possible if the court finds it was reasonably foreseeable that throwing a snap-bang could cause fear the same way a gun, or a realistic facsimile would.

Comparing this to the facts in the Driver case, one could ask if the victim's injuries were a reasonably foreseeable outcome of cuffing someone and slamming them face down on the pavement -- with or without meth in their system.

Of course, this is only the beginning of the analysis. Here are some other things you missed:

** Contributory negligence (or comparative, depending on the jurisdiction) on the part of the victim does not excuse wrongful behavior on behalf of the tortfeasor.

** The Egg-Shell Skull Rule.

** False arrest, and the limits of reasonable force in citizen's arrest or enforcement of the Shopkeeper's Privilege.

** Respondeat superior. Unless are you admitting that employers are usually liable for the actions of their employees.

OVERALL, the point of this debate is that these cases are not as black and white as you want them to be. You say this site shouldn't make assertions without mentioning all the facts. I say you shouldn't make assertions without understanding the law.

It undermines your credibility.

Posted by ThaMothership - September 14, 2009 09:34 PM

Iconoclast!?

Essentially, hearsay is only admissable if a lawyer can argue that the testimony is NOT legally defined as hearsay, although it may be considered hearsay by any other definition. Therefore, hearsay is NOT admissable.

You STILL fail to answer the question... should the article have mentioned that Driver was on meth?

Posted by Ike - September 15, 2009 04:29 AM

Successfully arguing that the statement is non-hearsay is the best option, but NOT the only option. Think I'm wrong? Then I guess you'd better call EVERY law school in the nation and let them know they're wrong.

Here's an example from just one of the free resources available to the public:

http://criminal.findlaw.com/crimes/more-criminal-topics/evidence-witnesses/hearsay-evidence.html

Admittedly, that website is splitting hairs. In practice, you really only have three or four reliable ways to get hearsay admitted, and even that may dwindle depending on local rules (the above exceptions are federal rules) and the proclivities of the presiding judge.

Nonetheless, there are exceptions to the hearsay rule and I stand by my assertions.

What's next, are you going to tell me the Parol Evidence Rule has to do with getting out of jail early?

BTW, it was a good idea for you to dodge the rest of the material I offered. I feel *much* more inclined to answer your questions.

Posted by ThaMothership - September 15, 2009 08:52 PM

TMS-

Your words (my emphasis): "That is why you spend 10 minutes learning that HEARSAY IS INADMISSIBLE..."

I didn't address the rest of your post because I don't want to get bogged down in your distractions from the main argument here. If you're fishing for an argument on various legal terms, I'll bite. But only after the previous argument is resolved. Until then.. your various tangents are only attempts, by you, to avoid answering the main question... Does the UFCW intentionally leave out pertinent information in these blogs? You seemed to inadvertently yield that point in the blog about the paperless paychecks!

Posted by Ike - September 16, 2009 04:33 AM

Ike,

Thank you for proving my point once again. As I said earlier, a blanket statement like "hearsay is inadmissible" is an overly-simplistic and sophomoric assertion. Your continued ignoring of the myriad ways to get around the rule reveals either stubborn ignorance, or an inability to grasp the complexities of the concept.

A good comparison would be a child saying the sky is blue. This is true, to an extent. At some point in our lives, however, we learn that actually the sky is not blue. It only appears blue because of the way light interacts with the atmosphere. From that point on, continuing to stubbornly assert that the sky really is blue is childish and naive.

This reinforces my initial assertions regarding your fixation on a perceived smoking gun. A missing fact is not necessarily a material fact. Particularly when the circumstances, namely the actions of the employees, are so overwhelmingly egregious (harkening back to Shopkeeper's Privilege, Egg-Shell Skull, etc).

Perhaps you missed it, as it was a subtle assertion. Next time I will remember to phrase my responses in a more ham-handed way, so as to be more easily recognized.

"Me answer question number one now..."

Posted by ThaMothership - September 16, 2009 09:28 PM

TMS-

Nice zingers! Congratulations! By your own standards, if you truly believe that I have an "inability to grasp the complexities" of your argument.. then doesn't that make you a jerk for arguing with me, since you apparently deem me to be mentally incapable of comprehending the concepts, thereby making me unworthy of debating you?

Just because lawyers can use loopholes to backdoor hearsay into their argument or to "get around the rule", as you put it, doesn't mean the rule doesn't exist. Remind me how hearsay and other various legal concepts are even relevant to this discussion.

This is not a question of law. We are not debating the guilt or innocence of Walmart or Driver. Clearly, you feel more comfortable debating legal terms than debating the actual topic... because you insist on turning this into an argument about hearsay, etc. It's not that your postings are too subtle (your attacks are anything BUT subtle)... it's that they are irrelevant.

This is really a debate about the accuracy of this particular blog and, by extension the accuracy of WUWMs blogs in general. My statement is that the true purpose of these blogs is to outrage, not inform, because there are conspicuous gaps in the information presented. Your response seems to be that I'm wrong because I'm ignorant and don't understand the complexities of hearsay!? That argument is completely irrelevant. I was just hoping you... or someone else... could do better than that.

Posted by Ike - September 16, 2009 10:47 PM

Ike,

How is hearsay relevant? Well, I made this comment:

"Your words: "Actual cause carries more weight." That's like saying hearsay is inadmissible."

You didn't understand that this was an ironic comment intended to imply you didn't understand the depth of the issue, and so you proceeded to try prove me wrong.

How'd that turn out for you?

Posted by ThaMothership - September 16, 2009 11:11 PM

TMS-

Just because you won't accept that you're wrong doesn't necessarily mean that you weren't proven wrong.

Also, that's not exactly irony there but please don't take this as an invitation to debate the definition of "irony" at length. You made that statement as if the two sentences/ideas were parallels... the truth of one matches the truth of the other. I mentioned that hearsay IS inadmissable as an aside to show that your absurd parallel actually is in the favor of my argument. I didn't intend the parallel to become the BASIS of the argument because there obviously IS no parrallel. Since the parallel is not legitimate, the statement about hearsay is irrelevant to the statement about actual cause... which is why I repeatedly questioned its relevance as we debated it.

I was referring to "actual cause" in terms of the article, not in terms of any legal case. This never was a debate about law... its a debate about journalism. Don't you think that Driver's drug use and criminal history is more relevant to the article than his occupation or parental status?

Posted by Ike - September 17, 2009 12:17 AM

Here's what I argued, in a simple form:

"Actual cause carries more weight." This sentence is over-simplifying and naive.

"Hearsay is inadmissible." This sentence is over-simplifying and naive.

Wow, the lack of a parallel is staggering. I mean, how could two sentences with totally different words be similar in any way whatsoever??

Though both sentences make assertions, neither assertion was intended as true.

Wow, the lack of irony is staggering.

And you wonder why I refuse to take you seriously...

Posted by ThaMothership - September 17, 2009 12:51 AM

You missed the point. The truth of one sentence doesn't depend on the truth of the other. Even if you successfully argue that hearsay is admissable, it doesn't prove that proximate cause carries more weight. Yet, that's the argument you're making because you've somehow made the two sentences relevent to each other in your own mind.

You made a good point in your response to me in another blog. I was wrong to think that people could exchange legitimate ideas here. If I ever need to trade insults with someone, I now know where to go.

Posted by Ike - September 17, 2009 04:17 AM

Ike,

Your words: "The truth of one sentence doesn't depend on the truth of the other."

I never said they did. I never even hinted at this. I never even said they were related, except that both sentences are examples of over-simplifying a broader issue.

I've done everything I can to explain this simple, simple concept to you short of drawing pictures with stick figures in crayon, and you come back at me with a straw man argument about how *I* missed the point of *my* own assertion.

Does ANYONE take you seriously?

Posted by ThaMothership - September 17, 2009 10:55 AM

Me now explain missed point again. The point you missed wasn't yours, it was mine. I'll try to explain it another way... again.

Unless you are claiming that the truth of one sentence depends on the truth of the other, the hearsay argument is a straw man. Whether hearsay is inadmissable is completely irrelevent to whether actual cause carries more weight than proximate cause, which is in turn irrelevant to whether this article is leaving out pertinent information.

I find it odd that you now have a problem with straw men. Every one of your responses, with the exception of your link to an arbitrary "living wage" definition, has been a straw man.

The point I'm making is simple... these blogs don't give the whole story because relevent facts are conspicuously absent. Your various distractions regarding legal terminology have nothing to do with that point.

I'd be glad to continue an argument about hearsay and other various terms if that's the direction you want to take. Just let it be noted that it is absolutely irrelevant to any other points made on these blogs and is really of no consequence to the Wake Up Walmart movement.

Posted by Ike - September 18, 2009 04:39 AM

So...you think that in order to be valid, an analogy must be causally linked, or somehow corollary to the referenced statement?

So...if you think that someone has said something naive, before you would respond with a comment like, "Well, duh, that's like saying water is wet," you would first need to establish a direct link between water and the matter at hand? Then, you would need to analyze the potential semantics surrounding the words "water" and "wet" in order to make sure the analogy is valid under all possible circumstances?

Or could it be...just maybe...that the statement "That's like saying water is wet" is merely a snide comment to illustrate how naive the referenced statement is, and that the analogy is valid IN THE ABSTRACT?

And could it be...just maybe...that spending time analyzing the physical properties of water ("It's not wet when it's frozen! So there! I sure showed you!") merely betrays a greater naivete than originally suspected?

What if I chose a different phrase with the same implication, say, "That's like asking 'does a bear s**t in the woods?'" Would you promptly go to the forest to determine for yourself the precise validity of this analogy, and then rack your brain trying to figure out the connection between this and the matter at hand?

...or would you see past the literal reading, and...you know...GET THE JOKE??

Of course, this analogy itself must be invalid and completely irrelevant to the matter at hand, because it never mentions actual cause or hearsay. Silly me.

Posted by ThaMothership - September 18, 2009 08:48 PM

You don't think that an extended argument about hearsay is irrelevant? Mentioning it as part of an insult was fine, I guess, but spending days arguing over it is pointless. That's all I'm saying; yet, even that point you won't concede without a conflict? Rather than simply agreeing that the hearsay tangent is irrelevant and should be dropped, you now wish to turn this into an argument over whether or not I "get" the insult!?

I think it's obvious that this discussion with you will never evolve beyond insults and straw men. You've never addressed the main point and have only addressed it once in any of our other arguments. I think we can both agree that these discussions are going nowhere so I think you'd also agree that investing any more time into these pointless conversations would be a waste. It's too bad that the only argument you could muster against my challenge to a "living wage" is that I'm a jerk, therefore a "living wage" could (and should) be paid. The best argument against my claim that these blogs intentionally omit information is that hearsay is admissable in court, therefore these blogs obviously give us the full story.

I made the mistake of addressing one of your distractions so I'll try to avoid doing so again in the future. I wish I could say it's been enlightening but...

Good luck to you, ThaMothership. Keep working on those zingers and I'm sure you'll go places with them!

Posted by Ike - September 19, 2009 09:59 AM

If "I made the mistake of addressing one of your distractions" is your way of saying you regret repeatedly telling me I'm wrong about something, despite incontrovertible evidence (such as every evidence text book in the country) to the contrary, well, heck, I'll concede that.

If something is genuinely irrelevant, you let it go, and don't try to prove it wrong -- especially when it isn't. In your case, if the discussion isn't going the way you want it to go, then you call it irrelevant over and over to try and get things back on your terms.

These are two very different things, and preceisely why I don't take your whining seriously.

And really, where did you think it would go? We're arguing on the internet. Did you confuse this with school? Did you picture yourself as Socrates, educating the masses through dialogue?

I do this because it makes me laugh. I may make some good arguments here and there, but when I need a good intellectual debate I just get up in the morning and go to work.

Posted by ThaMothership - September 19, 2009 02:49 PM

Son't steal, don't run, don't fight, don't do meth, don't die.

Simple.

Only one person caused Stacy Driver's death and that was Stacy Driver.

One less dumbass in the world, more air for me to breathe.

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